Best Johto Starter?

On 03-Jul-2009 Traffic Monger said:

You can get a Magmar from the Burnt Tower iirc, which isn't too much later into the game. Rate_me, I never really liked using the tier list for much other than movesets. Granted, Smogon does know what they're talking about, but they're getting a bit too almighty imo.

The teir thing was just a side note. Meganium's stats aren't that great and there are better support Pokemon. Since neither Typhlosion nor Feraligatr are support Pokemon, the only way to determine which is better is to look at usefulness. Meganium is outclassed by things like Venusaur and Shaymin, while Typhlosion is fragile and has poor typing. Feraligatr is decently bulky, has a good offense, Dragon Dance, and defensive typing. It's like an off-brand Gyarados.

On 03-Jul-2009 rate_me said:

The teir thing was just a side note. Meganium's stats aren't that great and there are better support Pokemon. Since neither Typhlosion nor Feraligatr are support Pokemon, the only way to determine which is better is to look at usefulness. Meganium is outclassed by things like Venusaur and Shaymin, while Typhlosion is fragile and has poor typing. Feraligatr is decently bulky, has a good offense, Dragon Dance, and defensive typing. It's like an off-brand Gyarados.

I'd have to agree with you on that; I also like that it's not quad-weak to electric. I also agree that Typhlosion doesn't have the best of typing, but it could be a lot worse. I'll probably use a Wigglytuff in place of my starter, since it's somewhat like a Clefable, but Clefairy can't be obtained until Kanto. Not to mention it's my second favorite Pokemon in general.

On 02-Jul-2009 DemonOfSand said:

Cynda and Toto for the win. Chikorita sucks because of it's terrible movepool, terrible stats and prectically all the moves it learns by level up is wither Grass type or something stupid.

And just to make you mad, Grovyle sucks, Torterra for the win.

Ok seriously, everybody does that. I am used to that so im not very offended...
Plus grovyle can learn leaf blade, leaf storm, earthquake by TM, (I know torterra learns it...)
giga impact, toxic, and even better.

On 03-Jul-2009 Pokemonhacker68 said:

Ok seriously, everybody does that. I am used to that so im not very offended...
Plus grovyle can learn leaf blade, leaf storm, earthquake by TM, (I know torterra learns it...)
giga impact, toxic, and even better.

@Volke: True, but Sceptile is just better IMO.

@...I forgot your name, someone who said something about Terra being slow: Speed isn't always good. Torterra is a moving tank that can deliver quite a punch.

@quoted post: Why does everyone use moves like Giga Impact and Hyper Beam in their arguement? Giga Impact and the likes are terrible moves, esspecially for competative. Why does Sceptile need EQ? Oh, it learns Leaf Blade and Leaf Storm, it can't learn Wood Hammer or Superpower(last I checked on superpower).

...Now you're got me off topic. We were discussing best Johto Starter, not best Starter all around. Let's go back to focusing on that shall we. I also do apologize for be apart of this off-topicnesssssss...s.

Rate_Me - The tier list is for competitive battling only. Whilst it does give a reflection of how pokemon are in-game, it shouldn't be taken as seriously for such matter.

Traffic Monger - Magmar isn't what I'd call better.

PokemonHacker68 - Giga Impact = fail.

DemonofSand - Sceptile was better in 3rd gen, but in 4th gen it's very debatable, with the addition of the fact that you can't really compare the two as they function completely differently. I could go on to explain why, but you seem to be knowledgable enough to know why, and as you've already stated we are going off topic.

On 04-Jul-2009 Volke said:

Rate_Me - The tier list is for competitive battling only. Whilst it does give a reflection of how pokemon are in-game, it shouldn't be taken as seriously for such matter.

Traffic Monger - Magmar isn't what I'd call better.

PokemonHacker68 - Giga Impact = fail.

DemonofSand - Sceptile was better in 3rd gen, but in 4th gen it's very debatable, with the addition of the fact that you can't really compare the two as they function completely differently. I could go on to explain why, but you seem to be knowledgable enough to know why, and as you've already stated we are going off topic.

I know. I already adressed that. First post of the page, remember? Here:
"The teir thing was just a side note. Meganium's stats aren't that great and there are better support Pokemon. Since neither Typhlosion nor Feraligatr are support Pokemon, the only way to determine which is better is to look at usefulness. Meganium is outclassed by things like Venusaur and Shaymin, while Typhlosion is fragile and has poor typing. Feraligatr is decently bulky, has a good offense, Dragon Dance, and defensive typing. It's like an off-brand Gyarados."

all in all Cyndaquil is the best. Think about it with the right nature and EVS it can learn thunderpunch and 1HKO a normal Feraligatr. and 2HKO or 3 at most a Feraligatr with defence EVs.It doesnt have to worry about meganium cause fire moves like Fire Punch,FLame Wheel etc can take care of it.

On a side note will Cyndaquil learn Physical Fire Moves. I mean all i can rememeber it learned(this is by level up by the way)was flame wheel and that was it.

On 05-Jul-2009 ShadowStriker64 said:

all in all Cyndaquil is the best. Think about it with the right nature and EVS it can learn thunderpunch and 1HKO a normal Feraligatr. and 2HKO or 3 at most a Feraligatr with defence EVs.It doesnt have to worry about meganium cause fire moves like Fire Punch,FLame Wheel etc can take care of it.

On a side note will Cyndaquil learn Physical Fire Moves. I mean all i can rememeber it learned(this is by level up by the way)was flame wheel and that was it.

You're making the biggest mistake in the book - comparing pokemon by having them fight each other.

Feraligatr can OHKO Typhlosion with Waterfall anyway, so, on an additional note, your point is wrong.

I'm agreeing with Vasco here; Feraligatr can probably take that Thunderpunch because it's defenses aren't that bad and kill with Waterfall, since Typhlosion is pretty fragile. And the only OU starters are Swampert, and the Sinnoh starters, barring Torterra. The only time that you'd battle the starters in-game is against Silver.


« Last edited by Traffic Monger on Jul 5th 2009 »

On 05-Jul-2009 Traffic Monger said:

I'm agreeing with Vasco here; Feraligatr can probably take that Thunderpunch because it's defenses aren't that bad and kill with Waterfall, since Typhlosion is pretty fragile. And the only OU starters are Swampert, and the Sinnoh starters, barring Torterra. The only time that you'd battle the starters in-game is against Silver.

Swampert is OU, too.

Traffic Monger youre wrong

In Viridian City you could vs a trainer named Cal oncea day who had the three johto starters fully evoloved at lvl 50.

Thats's true ShadowStriker64 I went up against her and almost lost cause I had with me one weak team with me. Mi fav starter would be Totodile cause if u don't own a Pokemon Coloseum, Pokemon XD Gale of Darkness or an Action Replay u could not get him or the other starters, I got my starters from coloseum and then have breeded them and transfered them from ruby to leafgreen to diamond and now to platinum. But seriously totodile is the best cause it has a good move set and good stats.

« Last edited by Megaman XYZ USA on Jul 5th 2009 »

obviously you didnt play it

Cal was a guy

On 05-Jul-2009 Megaman XYZ USA said:

Thats's true ShadowStriker64 I went up against her and almost lost cause I had with me one weak team with me. Mi fav starter would be Totodile cause if u don't own a Pokemon Coloseum, Pokemon XD Gale of Darkness or an Action Replay u could not get him or the other starters, I got my starters from coloseum and then have breeded them and transfered them from ruby to leafgreen to diamond and now to platinum. But seriously totodile is the best cause it has a good move set and good stats.

We're not talking about how to obtain them or Colosseum or Gale of Darkness, plus, if you needed them that badly, buy Emerald and complete the national dex. You can choose from the three Johto starters.

On 05-Jul-2009 Traffic Monger said:

I'm agreeing with Vasco here; Feraligatr can probably take that Thunderpunch because it's defenses aren't that bad and kill with Waterfall, since Typhlosion is pretty fragile. And the only OU starters are Swampert, and the Sinnoh starters, barring Torterra. The only time that you'd battle the starters in-game is against Silver.

Torterra is also classed as an OU standard pokemon, but became UU because nobody ever uses it due to the presence of pokemon such as Celebi. The same goes for Charizard, but his case is more debatable.

On 06-Jul-2009 Volke said:

Torterra is also classed as an OU standard pokemon, but became UU because nobody ever uses it due to the presence of pokemon such as Celebi. The same goes for Charizard, but his case is more debatable.

Don't forget their 4x weaknesses to Ice and Rock respectively. Having those weaknesses really hurt their usage. Swampert's weakness to Ice doesn't hurt its usage because that's its only weakness.

You mean Grass, I assume.

i assume he does volke i assume he does

but seriously it looks like chiko is out of hte pictuer so is really between totdile and cyndaquil

I think Totodile is better, but Cyndaquil is much more convenient.

I suppose, if you don't want to go with Magmar. Totodile is the best, but there are better water types in Johto than him.