NFL - Discussion Thread

What happened to the Rams offense? 3 points! You have to be kidding me, the the Patriot defence isn't that good. What went wrong? Makes you wish the Saints had of reached the big stage, they would have scored more than 3 points under Brees that's for sure. I never saw the game but from what I read this morning they are saying it is the worst Super Bowl ever, when I think of some of the stinkers of the past it must have been pretty bad.

Next year I will go with Kansas City against New Orleans. Any team but the Patriots again. Unless there is a breakout team next year I can't see past New Orleans, L.A. Rams, New England, and Kansas City reaching the big game. I'd like to see the Bears go up a level with their defense and Cleveland to start knocking on the playoff door, both of which I think will happen next year.

I agree what you say about the Redskins, they have to offload the the money promised to Smith and use the next two seasons to develop a rookie and hope he turns out to be another Cousins or Brady, a low round draft pick that excels. The only problem with that is every other team in the NFL is trying to do the same.


« Last edited by Sanzano on Feb 4th 2019 »

I managed to watch the second half on TV, and basically LA Rams got stagefright until midway through the 3rd quarter. Both defenses played very well, although the LA Rams defense fell apart on NE's final game-sealing drive. The commentators did describe the game as if Belichick knew all the routes LAR would run and thus the defense listened to him and completely shut them down.

LA Rams just looked lost. Goff did his best, but was under pressure constantly. There weren't enough rushing plays called, and in general it failed. Gurley rushed 10 times for 35 yards, and Anderson 7 times for 22 yards. Meanwhile when trailing 3-10 and pinning NE inside their own 10, the defense allowed NE to rush for 26 yards TWICE on the FINAL NE PLAY of the Superbowl. Sean McVay got thoroughly outcoached today.

Bizarrely, there seemed to be more crowd support for New England, despite the SB being played in Atlanta; the team who were on the receiving end of a 3-28 deficit turning into a 34-28 lead.

This is what happens, more often than not, when the Pats have two full weeks to scheme against you. They annihilated the Chargers, and they basically did the same to the Rams. They almost completely eliminated Donald, and it helped that Gurley, clearly, wasn't 100%. That being said, I'm glad Brady won. Heck of a guy, heck of team player; he deserved to be 6-3 rather than 5-4.

It's way too early, but one must expect the Super Bowl to be Chiefs/Pats vs Saints/Rams, but that could easily change before the season. If Chiefs do nothing to get better on defense, then there is a chance we'll get a repeat in next year's playoffs. The Rams also have a number of guys that will be free agents this year, so that will be interesting. On top of this, you have to expect the Falcons & Packers to bounce back after their disappointing seasons this year.

I bet Brady shook the opposition players' hands now that he won. Apparently last SB he just ran off the field to the locker room when they lost... I hear mixed things about Brady. But I still can't believe you support him. Support him when he's retired and the AFC East becomes winnable please!

I spotted an ironic quote from Dennis last SB:

538 yards and 41 points given up, what happened to the Patriots defense?

Clearly this team learn from their mistakes...lol. 41 points conceded turns into 3...

LA Rams may lose several players in free agency this off-season. Seeing at how awful the offense played versus a quality defense reminded me of their 6-15 horror defeat to Chicago. A well coached defense can easily shut down this LA Rams team, and at times the defense can be vulnerable (conceded scores such as 31, 31, 45, 31, 51, 30, and 32). The defense conceded 30+ points on 7/18 occasions, meaning there's big pressure for the offense to perform. But sometimes it flops. When LA Rams fail to score 26 points or more, they are 1-3 (0-3 in the last 3), and in those games Goff's passer rating has been 58.8, 19.1, 75.9, and 57.9. I actually think they will surrender the division title to an ever-improving Seattle team.

WAY-too early playoff predictions: (the days after the SB last season I predicted Jacksonville & LA Rams)
Kansas City
New England
Cleveland
Indy
Denver
NY Jets (bold prediction)

Green Bay (bold prediction)
New Orleans
Seattle
NY Giants (bold prediction)
LA Rams
Atlanta

I still can't get my head around how New England have won another Super Bowl, they know how to beat the system. I'm convinced they'd be able to do it with any top 10 quarterback, not just Brady. Bellichick has to be the greatest coach ever, the guy has won Super Bowls with two different teams and a multitude of different players. When is the guy going to retire? If you asked me who would be the first person you would hire if you were starting a team and you could choose anyone in the NFL I would take Belichick.

Dennis, Ryan Tannehill could've won a SB if Miami were in the place of LA Rams. 13 points in a SB is very poor, and NE were lucky to be facing an overrated Rams team that got stagefright. I mean far out, New Orleans would've steamrolled New England had they advanced.

LA Rams made several tactical failures. The most prominent was to abandon their run game and specifically Gurley. In the NFC Championship game he had 4 runs, and yesterday 10. Yet McVay and Gurley both say there is no injury. Either McVay screwed up big time, or they are lying. And I'm not sure what the heck happened to their pass rush. Brady just stood and delivered during the 4th quarter. Then there's conceding two 26-yard rushing gains (when they KNEW New England were going to run the ball) with less than 4 minutes left in the game.

There's also the other possibility that the NFL is actually NFLWWE. In that scenario, the NFL realises that Brady and New England need to get their 6th title, so they tell the Houston defense to choke in week 16 (to give NE the #2 seed), and decline the PI call in LAR @ NO (so that an inexperienced team (from the struggling city of Los Angeles) face Brady). If you look, one of the refs tells another (who was looking directly at the 2 players) to not give the penalty. Then subsequently, Gurley is literally benched for parts of the Superbowl. And if you think this scenario is rubbish, think back:

- Atlanta held a 28-3 lead in a Superbowl, and lost, to guess who
- Philly were trailing 6-10 at HT in the divisional round to Atlanta the next season and won due to Atlanta scoring 0 more points and Julio Jones forgetting how to catch a ball in the end zone on the last play
- Fournette pulled his hands away from the ball near the end of the AFC Championship game instead of catching it, running into the end zone, and giving Jacksonville a 27-24 win.
- A New Orleans cornerback tackled the air instead of Steffon Diggs in the divisional round, resulting in the Minneapolis Miracle and Philly being able to host a mentally-drained team the next week
- The 3 examples above outside of the quote box

But like you say, it's more about the New England system than the QB. Not saying Brady is a system QB, but he certainly benefits. I think if Brady didn't end up playing for New England, he absolutely wouldn't be the GOAT. He's certainly benefited from the AFC East and Belichick.

It seems appropriate for Belichick and Brady to retire together. Unless they offer Belichick a lot of money to stay on and help the transition, he'll move on. Brady will play for I'd say another 3 seasons, so I think the 2022/23 off-season is the date to look forward to.

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 5th 2019 »

That's another 3 seasons you can expect to see the Patriots in the final four. The experience the team gets going to Super Bowls each year must also help. Sounds like the Rams got stage fright in the big game seeing as none of the team had experienced the hoopla that goes with it.

I have a feeling if Kansas can sort out their defense they will be the best team in the league for the next few years.

I agree with KC, but they need to be very careful. We thought Oakland and Dallas would turn into mini-dynasties, and one team has been gutted & will be moving to a tourist's city, and the other has a QB who has digressed and the team in general has become mediocre. KC need to make sure their offense (and specifically Mahomes) stays at a high level.

There's no hope in terms of stopping NE. They had an 11-5 regular season record (6-4 outside the AFC East) and in all honesty a mediocre squad, but still dominated in the playoffs. Send Brady and Belichick off to Arizona right now, and they would finish 11-5 in an extremely tough division. New England seem to have the exact same mantra as an Australian team which won 3 consecutive titles; when one soldier goes out, another comes in. It doesn't matter who plays around Brady and Belichick.

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 5th 2019 »

I think the other thing is that players who get to put on the Patriot uniform feel like winners before they even touch the ball. It must give them confidence knowing that Belichick is calling the plays and Brady is executing them. It was what they said about Joe Montana, the game was never over with him behind center, he just wanted to win. I think Brady has the same mentality. Lots of the quarterbacks around the league are like Cousins who are more interested in their paycheck than winning.

I'd be interested to find out just what the New England club culture is like. As in what the feeling would be like at for example a training session. Imo club culture is the most important thing a team can have. Someone like Cousins who left Washington because he wanted more tens of millions of dollars must harm the club culture, especially since Minnesota ditched the popular Case Keenum in favour of him.

Just look at Cleveland. Yes Mayfield can get a bit cocky and say controversial things, but he's very popular among his teammates and has almost single-handedly changed that team's culture.

This is why Philly will struggle once Nick Foles leaves (he has declined his $20 mill contract so that he can potentially become a starter for another team). Especially with those rumours about Wentz coming out. Foles is probably the most popular player at the club, and especially with the fans. I can only imagine the atmosphere around the club all of the 2018 off-season. Now it's starting to fade.

Like you say, everyone's confidence must be sky high at New England. The players definitely want to play for 2 guys like Brady and Belichick. When the team has a loss, they must not even flinch because they just know they'll get back to winning ways. There was even a member of the defense who came from Cleveland. 0-16 one season, and a Superbowl win the next.

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 6th 2019 »

Yeah, Belichick and Brady are the greatest ever at their respective positions. To think, they should actually be 8-1 in Super Bowls (Atlanta, believe it or not, should've been their only loss). Still, winning 66% of Super Bowls is unheard of, except, of course, if a team has won 2/3. I can appreciate the greatness.

Lol. I believe Baltimore have won 100% of Super Bowls.

All jokes aside, I see your point, but that's an unfair statement (saying they should be 8-1). Just because you're the favourite doesn't mean you 'should' win. I can go and say that Seattle 'should have' ran the ball. I can also say that LA Rams 'should have' been able to score more than 13 points. But they didn't, just as Brady didn't manage to avoid being sacked on NE's final drive of SBVII.

It's the work they do in the regular season and playoffs that have been stunning. If you make it to 9 SBs, you're bound to win a fair few times (unless you're Buffalo or Minnesota lol). The fact that they turn up every season and win minimum 11 games (even with Matt Cassel) sets them up. How they consistently make AFC Championship games is, as much as I hate saying it, amazing.

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 6th 2019 »

I wonder where the next dynasty is going to come from? I know it seems farfetched but it could be Cleveland, another couple of decent drafts and that team is going to be loaded with talent on offense and defense. They're already starting to climb up the rankings after being the laughing stock of the league for so long and have to be given careful consideration when tipping these days.

Speaking of Cleveland, they're right on topic. They just signed Kareem Hunt from KC. He'll face a suspension, but will eventually be free to play. What is interesting there is that John Dorsey worked at KC before joining Cleveland last season, and had a good relationship with Hunt since college in 2016. If Hunt is ever going to be rehabilitated, Cleveland is the place it will happen at.

But like you say, Cleveland are on the way up. I'm with you, and fully expect them to win the AFC North. That was without Hunt. If he gets rehabilitated and can return the same explosive player, they will have him and Nick Chubb as running backs. That would be scary good.

I find is interesting that so many dynasties in sports start from the previous season being terrible. 0-16 certainly was terrible, but is reminds me of how Dallas went from 1-15 one season to a dynasty the next few. Cleveland are in a division with Pittsburgh (Bell and Brown are surely leaving, and Big Ben doesn't have very long left), Baltimore (ageing defense, and a high-risk proposition at QB), and Cincy (I don't need to give an explanation here).

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 11th 2019 »

Wow, Kareem Hunt picked up by Cleveland. That makes up for not drafting Barkley and taking a chance with Mayfield. Things are starting to fall into place for Cleveland, all of a sudden you have to say they have one of the top three runningback duos in the league. Cleveland are a team going places, after Washington they have to be the next team I am interested in following, it will be interesting seeing how they develop. I wonder if the Browns will go for a top rookie wide reciever in this draft? They're already decent on defense so that is not a priority for them, they'll probably go for an offensive lineman to protect Mayfield thinking about it though.

I keep reading that Mayfield needs another WR, but it's not really a need. Like you say o-line is far better, since there's no point having superstar WRs of you don't have time to comfortably pass to them. I think Cleveland can get one in free agency. He's probably going to end up in San Fransisco, but the name I keep hearing popping up as a slight possibility to play for Cleveland is Antonio Brown.

I'm glad to hear you're not on the "Hunt should be banned for life!!!" team. The amount of people that hate him (and Cleveland) with a passion simply because he did one thing wrong is amazing. If he had form I would understand, but kicking a woman ONCE on one occasion only doesn't justify the outrage. He deserves another chance. If he screws up again then it's game over, but for all we know he was probably drunk and regretted the incident the next day.

Adding this here rather than double posting - Detroit's GM hasn't ruled out drafting a QB at pick 8.....

And also adding that Joe Flacco has been traded to Denver for a 4th round pick. What an awful decision from Denver!

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 14th 2019 »

Antonio Brown to Cleveland. Jesus, if that happens then Cleveland are serious Super Bowl contenders. They'll have elite weapons all over the place and a decent defense that will get better with the 2019 draft.

Have to laugh at Denver, they had one of the greatest quarterbacks in John Elway but the guy can't pick a decent successor to save his life. I wouldn't be happy if I was a Bronco fan.

Detroit to pick a quarterback? I thought Matthew Stafford was pretty good. I can't see that happening.

Before social media there were plenty of athletes in the NFL that did a lot worse than what Hunt did and nobody batted an eye lid. Everything gets blown out of all proportion these days. Give the guy a chance, he's only young, everyone makes mistakes.

Bizarrely, about half of the comments I've read online are supportive of Denver's decision. Those people mention that Flacco has a 10-5 postseason record and a SB title, and say that with a better o-line he will thrive. But Denver is a downgrade in o-line and wide receiver. Basically Keenum and Flacco are almost the same. Average QBs that had one amazing season at a different club.

Warrior is one that potentially supports the move, since he believed last season would be his resurgence to save his job. It'll be interesting to hear his thoughts next time he posts.

The interesting thing out of this is that he didn't go to Miami (phew) or Washington (phew) and now Keenum will be looking for a new team. It sounds like he's a good person in the locker room, but outside of Minnesota he is a backup QB at best. I hope he doesn't come to Miami.

Speaking of Miami and Washington, the latest rumour is that no teams have any interest in Tannehill *sigh*, but if he does go somewhere, Washington are the leading candidates...

The argument with Stafford is that he has achieved very little and is 31. But really it's the team that's the problem, not Stafford. They finally found a running game of sorts last season, but at the same time their o-line fell apart. I'd support drafting a QB in rounds 3 or 4 perhaps, but definitely not with pick 8.

« Last edited by Matt77 on Feb 15th 2019 »

Sorry. Been busy. Also sick right now. :(

Let me start by saying I laughed when I read that the AAF asked Kapernik to be a starting QB and he said no unless given 20 Million... Yeah right... Dude, you a backup... You were benched for Blaine Gabbert... Blaine Gabbert... XD

When is comes to Antonio Brown... You have to believe he'll be somewhere in the NFC next year. Steelers won't traded him within the AFC, unless, I think, to Oakland. I only say Oakland because the Steelers know the Raiders aren't a treat, plus the Raiders probably will be one of few teams that will be willing to give up a late first round pick for him (at least one that the Steelers will deal with). More than likely, the Steelers will have to settle for a 2nd Round Pick for him. Of course, the 49ers are in play then since they have a high 2nd Round Pick. We'll see.

Since AB is out of Pitt, I strongly believe the Steelers will then Franchise Tag Bell again. By no means do I think he will be on their roster next year; this would allow them to then trade Bell. The Steelers have a much better shot of trading Bell for a 1st Round Pick should they Franchise Tag him.

I see you guys were talking about Stafford... Believe it or not, I actually think he should be traded. The Lions aren't going anywhere with Stafford, and I think it's better to cut ties now (like Miami and Tannehill) and get some sort of draft compensation for him. The Lions could then turn to tanking (like Miami will be doing despite what most believe) in hopes of getting one of the top QBs in the 2020 Draft. Will it happen? Probably not. But I think they should at least consider it.

And yes, Matt, I did like the Flacco trade. Is Flacco the same QB he use to be? Skill set wise -- yes. Passion wise -- not really. But you would be crazy to say Flacco isn't better than Keenum. Maybe not by much overall, but he has a much stronger arm that, at the very least, will allow the Broncos to stretch the field and will prevent defenses from loading the box against them like last year. Plus, they gave up a fourth round pick for him. This is much better than drafting a QB you don't like, overspending on Bridgewater in free agency, or paying more in a trade for the likes of Nick Foles. At the bare minimum, the Broncos will be as good/bad as they were this year, allowing them to cut ties with Flacco (who won't have any money guaranteed moving forward) and Keenum (whose contract expires after 2019) before going after one of the touted 2020 QB Prospects.

As for the Draft, you have to think Bosa will be the #1 Pick. Unless, of course, a team trades up for a QB. At this point, I think Cardinals will stay at #1, since teams can just jump he Giants at #4 or #5. Becuase of this, I have Bosa (Ohio State) #1, Williams (Alabama) #2, Allen (Kentucky) #3, Gary (Michigan) #4, and then Jones (QB DUke) #5 (Trade).

I laughed at Kaepernick too. For basically the whole time I've supported him and his protesting, but now that support ends. He wanted $20 mill... For goodness sake, he should be thankful just to get a chance to play consecutive games as a certain starter. And after he clearly got paid off by the NFL, his reputation has been ruined in the eyes of those who supported him.

San Francisco seem to be the almost certain destination for AB. I hope for their sake he sorts out his attitude. Yes he'll be an amazing player for them, but his personality could make the locker room toxic. And as you say, 2nd round pick is what they will probably get, even though in reality AB is worth two 1st round picks.
And you're on the money with Bell. They would be crazy to let him walk for free (although moves this stupid have been made before in the recent past).

I get what you're saying with Stafford, but if they trade him they will finish last in the NFC. Actually now that I read that, I can see again why you think he should be traded. But if Detroit can draft well (I know, it's a BIG if), Stafford should be able to find the form he had in the 2016/17 and 2017/18 seasons. I'm not sure if you meant to compare them, but regardless I hope you realise that Stafford is in another tier of where Tannehill is.

The Flacco trade seems very similar to Alex Smith to Washington. In theory it is smart and prepares them for 2020, but what happens if Denver finish 8-8 and miss the playoffs? They will have to go to the draft with a pick around 14-18, meaning that trading up is their only option to land a good QB. How many other teams will be trying the same thing, and who will finish lower than them? Miami and Washington if they don't draft this year, Tampa Bay if they don't move on from Winston this draft, Cincy if they don't move on from Dalton this draft, and potentially Detroit. If you look at Miami and Washington this draft, their 1st round picks are in a similar spot to where I think Denver will end up in the 2020 draft. And they are facing the exact problem that I think Denver will face then.

I think one team is going to trade up to pick 1 or 2. We've seen it enough times in the past for it to happen again. Whether it's NY Giants/Jacksonville trying to guarantee first pick of a QB or Miami/Washington in desperation mode, the teams with very early picks could do with having more players to pick. But there has to be about a 10% or less chance of Jones being the first chosen QB.